Here's another question for you:
Is it wrong to choose not to judge or criticize a bishop's apparent wrongdoings, etc.
My very good friend and I get along very well(obviously, otherwise we wouldn't be friends ;-) until something like what happened recently in SF comes up in conversation. Then we part ways.
We don't stop being friends but the conversation comes to a dead stop.
No, in fact it takes great humility and strength not to do so. If his wrongdoing directly affects you, or it is something you know, and you must report it, it's different. But to just criticize or judge - particularly a priest - is wrong. I believe St. Josemaria Escriva dedicates a good number of his maxims in The Way, in regard to our verbal behavior and treatment of priests. I believe the Pieta prayer book also warns strongly against any ill humor, ill talk, criticism or judgement of priests.
ReplyDeleteYour friend and you are right in your silence - even if awkwardly noticeably (did I spell that right!? :-) - you are doing the right thing.
Pray for them - pray for them - pray for them!
Blessings,
Denise
A very difficult choice.
ReplyDeleteI think Denise said what I would say also. I especially love the last sentence. So necessary.
Thanks Denise and Mickie. That is what I thought. Good suggestion.
ReplyDeleteI pray for them on a daily basis.
Denise, thanks for the prayers and reference you emailed me!!
I guess it would depend on what that something was. If a bishop was not standing up for the faith and letting secular powers that be ride herd over him, then I think it would be wrong NOT to speak up - else we get more of the same. Now if it's something internal like "Why did you send priest X to that parish" or "why is the lightbulb blue on your front porch" then I think we should give the bishop a break.
ReplyDeleteI don't think there is anything wrong with mentioning it to a close friend and then praying with that friend for the Bishop.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I once knew someone who wanted to criticize the priests and the Bishop whever a group of people from church got together - which I thought was very inappropriate. It was malicious gossip and slander. I refused to participate and would usually try to change the subject.
I finally wrote this individual a letter (which was tactful yet truthful) about how uncomfortable I felt when she brought up the subject and explained why. She avoided me after that, which actually wasn't so bad.
Once several years ago, I was with a small group of people at a party and a priest told us all something about the Bishop and the seminarians which I found shocking. I said nothing, but immediately started to pray about the situation, as I knew that Satan was responsible for what was going on.
I knew the priest felt helpless in this situation and wanted our support so I offered up my prayers. I am not sure what the others did - they were all in shock, too.
I just wanted you to know that in the letter I wrote to that woman who criticized priests constantly, I quoted parts of the Pieta about not criticizing priests. Shortly after that, our pastor gave a homily on that subject, which was my confirmation that I did the right thing. She was at that Mass listening to the homily.
ReplyDeleteJean and others,
ReplyDeleteYour stories surely help! I too have been in situations where "groups" of people speak very critically (and some of it so incredibly nit-picky and superficial) of our priests, all the way to the Bishop. It is scandalous, to say the least, for other priests and seminarians to be included in this kind of gossip. Parishioners/lay people are put in the middle - of the cross fire. It is even more wrong for a priest to gossip about other brother priests - nonetheless his own Bishop ):
I think it is a true test - it is not easy to not "fall in" with then naysayers and gossipers, but are intregity muscles are strengthened each time we are subjected to that kind of thing.
God bless you all!
Denise
P.S. Esther, you are welcome for the references. I find them very helpful!
Karen, I agree. I was referring to one friend criticizing a bishop's action (giving communion to Gay militants) and the other friend telling her we shouldn't criticize bishops or priests.
ReplyDeleteJean, that is what I am afraid of..that is is only going to lead to slander and gossip. Good for you!
Well said Denise.
ReplyDeleteI tend to agree with Gem.
ReplyDeleteThere were a few serious situations several years ago involving child abuse that were ignored in the diocese and the people (teachers who had witnessed it) who were trying to bring it to the attention of the bishop were legally threatened and also threatened to be excommunicated by the bishop for making accusations against the priest. Now we are being sued for that particular case plus other cases. Don't want to go all the way into it...but I think that that was wrong!
Our former bishop also said the gospels were myths. What do you say then? It's so hard to know what to do...also I think of the arian heresy or that bishop in S Africa (I think that was where it was). I saw his website. Very sick and sad.
OTOH the bishop we have now is doing his best to rectify a few things and not getting any help from the Chancery and people moan he isn't doing enough. He can only do so much.
I will understand if you decide to delete this!
No, I wouldn't delete your comment.
ReplyDeleteI was referring to talking about it as opposed to actively doing something about a wrong. Of course if you see an evil such as a child being abused, it is our responsibility to do something about it.
I see know one particular priest who commits a few liturgical abuses at each Mass he celebrates. It would be very unfair for me to criticize him because I don't know what his motives for doing them are. Maybe he doesn't realize it.
I pray for him instead. It would be so easy to talk with my friends at the same Mass and "discuss" it. But what is the point?
These priests need our prayers, not our judgments.
Anyway, thanks ladies for a provocative discussion. I appreciate each and every one of the comments.
God bless,
I believe that we should speak up and never comnpromise our beliefs. Jesus came to the world not to bring peace... He always spoke the truth. St. Paul followed Christ's footsteps in that respect. The truth, because I am a peace loving person, this is something I am learning to do the hard way. God be praised for the grace He gives us to speak the truth openly or at least say what we think is right. If we are wrong on our end, God will shed the light. Thank you Esther.
ReplyDelete